james 's Reviews > November 9
November 9
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by
First of all a very big fuck you to past Jonathan who started this two weeks ago, read 30% and took 3 pages of notes, making it virtually impossible to dnf because all that work would have gone to waste then. Next time either finish it yourself or don't take notes, I hate you.
Can Colleen Hoover write likable male characters? Like is she even capable to? Because I doubt it.
This is my second Colleen Hoover book and once again the main male character is shit.
The first chapter of this book really could have fooled me into liking this but then Ben opened his mouth.
What is cute about Ben? Why do you all like about him? Explain it? Is it because he keeps going on about her panties? Are we into that? I genuinely want to know.
Why is it apparently considered sexy when a guy she has never met tells her he's been wondering whether or not she is wearing underwear since the second he first saw her because "he couldn't see an outline". How can you look at this and not find it creepy? It's disgusting. It's borderline sexual harassment. Imagine a stranger approaches you and tells you "Hey, so I've been staring at you and I just can't make out a pantie outline, are you not wearing any? That would be so hot." What exactly about this situation would make someone go "Omg he's so hot" instead of spraying them with five liters of pepper spray?
The worst thing about the whole "panties situation" is that Ben never stops going on about them? He still keeps talking about her underwear NINETY-SIX PERCENT in. It doesn't get cuter the more you mention it, it just gets more creepy.
Less than 10% in Ben says: "I like that you're insecure, that means I have a chance to see these panties.". 911, please help. This is just all kinds of wrong, I don't even know where to begin. The implication that he only has a chance with insecure women (maybe because confident women would recognize him for the creep that he is and call him out on his disgusting and manipulative behavior?) and that he will actually use her insecurities for his own gain? He's disgusting and a creep and if anyone likes him I'm suing.
He constantly forces her into uncomfortable situations. You know those situations are uncomfortable for her because Fallon's entire narrative just sounds like she is about to cry at any second and because she tells him MULTIPLE TIMES that she DOES NOT WANT to do the things he wants her to do.
He forces her to wear a dress that makes her wildly uncomfortable. She tells him she doesn't want to. He then proceeds to undress her, while she is CRYING. She wishes he would stop, she is crying, she is shaking - she doesn't voice this, because she's scared but, honestly? She shouldn't even have to. SHE IS CRYING FOR GOD'S SAKE. She shouldn't even have to ask him to stop, he should have never started in the first place.
He says he does this because he wants her to gain self-confidence. No.
Ben is a creep and there is nothing sexy about him nor about that he did. It was an invasion of personal space, just served to prove a point. She was uncomfortable the entire time but couldn't voice it because she is insecure - and he knew that. He just took advantage of her insecurities (as he already threatened to in the beginning) and showed a complete disregard for her personal comfort. He pretended it was to give her self-confidence but then he admits that he just did it so that he could see her underwear. That's not even mentioning that either way undressing her while she's crying is not the way to give her more self-confidence. It's just a complete disregard of her wishes and discomfort (which she did voice when she didn't want to wear the dress and which becomes apparent if you can read the most basic form of social clues), if anything this situation was just some kind of powerplay for him and honestly warrants a police report.
He tells her to go on dates because she doesn't have enough experience. She is 18. Meanwhile she tells him to read books. What a cute dynamic they have.
When they first have sex Fallon describes it as: "lost a part of herself inside him, giving away part of her soul to him". That's just what conservatives tell young girls to discourage them from having sex: that they will loose something of themselves, "dirtying" themselves if they have sex. What are you teaching your audience, Colleen? Why do you think this is okay?
The next morning when Fallon is like "I gotta go" Ben considers using physical violence to make her stay. How cute. What an OTP.
During a scene in a bar he drags her into a corner, demanding to know who the man is she is with. What is cute about this? This is not attractive. He is not protective, he is outright behaving like he owns her and deserves to know every single piece of personal information.
In the same corner, in the same bar, they start making out. Ben starts touching her and she clearly tells him to stop. He doesn't. He instead says "Ask again" and still doesn't stop.
In countries like Finland only a clear "Yes" is a sign of consensual sex. This was a clear "No". This is rape culture. This is normalizing not stopping even though your partner asks you to because you think "you know better what they want". Once again, Colleen, what are you teaching your audience? Why is Ben never called out on his behaviour?
This scene was apparently deleted from future additions, which is at least one step in the right direction.
Ben also practically forces her to get in contact with her father. The same man who told her in the beginning of the book that she is too ugly for broadway, that she will never find a job, that no-one will love her. And in the end we pretend like he was just misunderstood? And Fallon forgives him? Fuck that. Fuck your emotionally abusive parents. Fallon clearly didn't want contact when Ben told her to do it. He has no say in this. Fallon's father doesn't deserve forgiveness just because "he is her only father". No shit. But sometimes, people are better off without certain people in their lives.
SPOILERS
One time Ben tells her that: "It's your own fault people feel uncomfortable looking at you."
He tells her it's her fault that she has burn scars, that people react weirdly to her. This on it's own is disgusting enough, but then when you find out that HE CAUSED those scars? What the actual fuck? Does that boy have any kind of self-awareness?
This whole plot twist makes all his behaviour in this book even worse. He lied, he manipulated her, he DEMANDED to see her scars. The scars HE caused. This isn't cute, this isn't romantic. He pretends like he is helping her out of the goodness of his heart, to help her with her self-esteem issues, but this information changes everything. He is not. He caused those self-esteem issues. He is directly responsible, HE is the reason she can't have a normal life. He is FORCING her into a "normal" life because he feels bad for his actions. He's just doing it to soothe his conscious, to make himself feel better about his involvement. And he's not even doing a good job.
Ben is 99% of the reason why I hate this book. The rest include the following:
- Fallon's internal monologue just constantly sounds like she's about to cry. I get it. I would too if I was spending even one second with Ben.
- Fallon is so obsessed with Ben, even though he has never done anything good for her. His disgusting, creepy and manipulative behaviour just gets constantly brushed off and excused. Those two have met three times and act like they are soulmates. I get that there are years in between but the fact is they don't communicate between each November 9. They literally meet 3 times. They know basically nothing about each other. They are in love with the idea of the other person, not with the actual person. This is not a good nor a romantic portrayal of love.
- Ben literally starts dating his dead brother's wife a few months after his death. But then tells Fallon he would leave said wife if Fallon tells him that she loves him. What a great guy he is.
Final thoughts
Why is Ben forgiven for his actions? Why is the moral of the story basically that men can get away with anything if they have "good intentions", if it's "true love".
This is not true love.
This is someone who committed an act of violence inserting themselves in their victims life. Pretending they have pure intentions while lying to them and being manipulative and controlling.
This is not a cute story, this is not romantic. This should not have a happy ever after. Ben should have been called out on at least one of his actions. Ben does nothing to redeem himself. Yet he is forgiven because he is allegedly her "soulmate". If a soulmate forces themselves on you and treats you like shit in the name of "love", maybe we are all better off without them. If your partner acts like Ben does, call the police.
Ben does not deserve forgiveness. Ben deserves jail.
TL;DR: 0 stars.
Can Colleen Hoover write likable male characters? Like is she even capable to? Because I doubt it.
This is my second Colleen Hoover book and once again the main male character is shit.
The first chapter of this book really could have fooled me into liking this but then Ben opened his mouth.
What is cute about Ben? Why do you all like about him? Explain it? Is it because he keeps going on about her panties? Are we into that? I genuinely want to know.
Why is it apparently considered sexy when a guy she has never met tells her he's been wondering whether or not she is wearing underwear since the second he first saw her because "he couldn't see an outline". How can you look at this and not find it creepy? It's disgusting. It's borderline sexual harassment. Imagine a stranger approaches you and tells you "Hey, so I've been staring at you and I just can't make out a pantie outline, are you not wearing any? That would be so hot." What exactly about this situation would make someone go "Omg he's so hot" instead of spraying them with five liters of pepper spray?
The worst thing about the whole "panties situation" is that Ben never stops going on about them? He still keeps talking about her underwear NINETY-SIX PERCENT in. It doesn't get cuter the more you mention it, it just gets more creepy.
Less than 10% in Ben says: "I like that you're insecure, that means I have a chance to see these panties.". 911, please help. This is just all kinds of wrong, I don't even know where to begin. The implication that he only has a chance with insecure women (maybe because confident women would recognize him for the creep that he is and call him out on his disgusting and manipulative behavior?) and that he will actually use her insecurities for his own gain? He's disgusting and a creep and if anyone likes him I'm suing.
He constantly forces her into uncomfortable situations. You know those situations are uncomfortable for her because Fallon's entire narrative just sounds like she is about to cry at any second and because she tells him MULTIPLE TIMES that she DOES NOT WANT to do the things he wants her to do.
He forces her to wear a dress that makes her wildly uncomfortable. She tells him she doesn't want to. He then proceeds to undress her, while she is CRYING. She wishes he would stop, she is crying, she is shaking - she doesn't voice this, because she's scared but, honestly? She shouldn't even have to. SHE IS CRYING FOR GOD'S SAKE. She shouldn't even have to ask him to stop, he should have never started in the first place.
He says he does this because he wants her to gain self-confidence. No.
Ben is a creep and there is nothing sexy about him nor about that he did. It was an invasion of personal space, just served to prove a point. She was uncomfortable the entire time but couldn't voice it because she is insecure - and he knew that. He just took advantage of her insecurities (as he already threatened to in the beginning) and showed a complete disregard for her personal comfort. He pretended it was to give her self-confidence but then he admits that he just did it so that he could see her underwear. That's not even mentioning that either way undressing her while she's crying is not the way to give her more self-confidence. It's just a complete disregard of her wishes and discomfort (which she did voice when she didn't want to wear the dress and which becomes apparent if you can read the most basic form of social clues), if anything this situation was just some kind of powerplay for him and honestly warrants a police report.
He tells her to go on dates because she doesn't have enough experience. She is 18. Meanwhile she tells him to read books. What a cute dynamic they have.
When they first have sex Fallon describes it as: "lost a part of herself inside him, giving away part of her soul to him". That's just what conservatives tell young girls to discourage them from having sex: that they will loose something of themselves, "dirtying" themselves if they have sex. What are you teaching your audience, Colleen? Why do you think this is okay?
The next morning when Fallon is like "I gotta go" Ben considers using physical violence to make her stay. How cute. What an OTP.
During a scene in a bar he drags her into a corner, demanding to know who the man is she is with. What is cute about this? This is not attractive. He is not protective, he is outright behaving like he owns her and deserves to know every single piece of personal information.
In the same corner, in the same bar, they start making out. Ben starts touching her and she clearly tells him to stop. He doesn't. He instead says "Ask again" and still doesn't stop.
In countries like Finland only a clear "Yes" is a sign of consensual sex. This was a clear "No". This is rape culture. This is normalizing not stopping even though your partner asks you to because you think "you know better what they want". Once again, Colleen, what are you teaching your audience? Why is Ben never called out on his behaviour?
This scene was apparently deleted from future additions, which is at least one step in the right direction.
Ben also practically forces her to get in contact with her father. The same man who told her in the beginning of the book that she is too ugly for broadway, that she will never find a job, that no-one will love her. And in the end we pretend like he was just misunderstood? And Fallon forgives him? Fuck that. Fuck your emotionally abusive parents. Fallon clearly didn't want contact when Ben told her to do it. He has no say in this. Fallon's father doesn't deserve forgiveness just because "he is her only father". No shit. But sometimes, people are better off without certain people in their lives.
SPOILERS
One time Ben tells her that: "It's your own fault people feel uncomfortable looking at you."
He tells her it's her fault that she has burn scars, that people react weirdly to her. This on it's own is disgusting enough, but then when you find out that HE CAUSED those scars? What the actual fuck? Does that boy have any kind of self-awareness?
This whole plot twist makes all his behaviour in this book even worse. He lied, he manipulated her, he DEMANDED to see her scars. The scars HE caused. This isn't cute, this isn't romantic. He pretends like he is helping her out of the goodness of his heart, to help her with her self-esteem issues, but this information changes everything. He is not. He caused those self-esteem issues. He is directly responsible, HE is the reason she can't have a normal life. He is FORCING her into a "normal" life because he feels bad for his actions. He's just doing it to soothe his conscious, to make himself feel better about his involvement. And he's not even doing a good job.
Ben is 99% of the reason why I hate this book. The rest include the following:
- Fallon's internal monologue just constantly sounds like she's about to cry. I get it. I would too if I was spending even one second with Ben.
- Fallon is so obsessed with Ben, even though he has never done anything good for her. His disgusting, creepy and manipulative behaviour just gets constantly brushed off and excused. Those two have met three times and act like they are soulmates. I get that there are years in between but the fact is they don't communicate between each November 9. They literally meet 3 times. They know basically nothing about each other. They are in love with the idea of the other person, not with the actual person. This is not a good nor a romantic portrayal of love.
- Ben literally starts dating his dead brother's wife a few months after his death. But then tells Fallon he would leave said wife if Fallon tells him that she loves him. What a great guy he is.
Final thoughts
Why is Ben forgiven for his actions? Why is the moral of the story basically that men can get away with anything if they have "good intentions", if it's "true love".
This is not true love.
This is someone who committed an act of violence inserting themselves in their victims life. Pretending they have pure intentions while lying to them and being manipulative and controlling.
This is not a cute story, this is not romantic. This should not have a happy ever after. Ben should have been called out on at least one of his actions. Ben does nothing to redeem himself. Yet he is forgiven because he is allegedly her "soulmate". If a soulmate forces themselves on you and treats you like shit in the name of "love", maybe we are all better off without them. If your partner acts like Ben does, call the police.
Ben does not deserve forgiveness. Ben deserves jail.
TL;DR: 0 stars.
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Reading Progress
July 10, 2021
– Shelved as:
to-read
July 10, 2021
– Shelved
July 14, 2021
–
Started Reading
July 14, 2021
–
7.0%
"i mean kudos to Ben and all but he also listed two men and we all know that they do not have to adhere to the same beauty standards"
July 14, 2021
–
11.0%
"why is it that Colleen Hoovers male leads are always the kind of guy that get creepily sexual two seconds into meeting the female lead. and why are they always somehow into it? if a stranger told me he was wondering whether i was going commando because he couldn't see a "panty outline" one second into meeting me, i would call the police"
July 14, 2021
–
11.0%
""And then i noticed you were really insecure so I thought hell yeah, i might actually get a chance to see those panties."
hello?????? that's just all kinds of wrong. wtf."
hello?????? that's just all kinds of wrong. wtf."
July 14, 2021
–
12.0%
"good news guys, this shit (Ben) pissed me off so much i got my reading journal out and am taking notes for the inevitable 2 star rant"
July 14, 2021
–
14.0%
"Ben is a creep and there's nothing sexy about him nor about what he did. He claims he wanted to give her more self-confidence, yet his actions just feel like a kind of powerplay (evident when he mentions her panties yet again). He just completely disregarded her discomfort and took advantage of her insecurities. Hell she was crying the entire time? One step further and we would have been in police calling territory."
July 14, 2021
–
26.0%
""So what do you not like in romance novels?"
"Insta love"
"What's insta love?"
WHAT YOU HAVE"
"Insta love"
"What's insta love?"
WHAT YOU HAVE"
July 14, 2021
–
26.0%
"SHE IS BARELY 18 how many guys does the average girl have one night stands with at that age??"
July 14, 2021
–
29.0%
"how MANY TIMES will that guy KEEP MENTIONING her underwear?
will this just be five years of "hihi let's go inside, i need to know what colour your panties are. i'm so funny and that has always been such a sexy flirty joke and not creepy and annoying at all.""
will this just be five years of "hihi let's go inside, i need to know what colour your panties are. i'm so funny and that has always been such a sexy flirty joke and not creepy and annoying at all.""
July 15, 2021
–
30.0%
""Not that there's a difference between a 19-year-old and a men, they are the same thing."
hard disagree"
hard disagree"
July 30, 2021
–
42.0%
""When's your birthday?"
"July 4th."
"Mine is July 25th, so you're officially older."
???? you didn't even discuss what year?????"
"July 4th."
"Mine is July 25th, so you're officially older."
???? you didn't even discuss what year?????"
July 30, 2021
–
43.0%
"Fallon constantly sounds like she's about to cry, it's so annoying, why is this so needlessly dramatic
also Ben asking her to call her shitty father because "it's the only one she has", so what? maybe she doesn't want him in her life??"
also Ben asking her to call her shitty father because "it's the only one she has", so what? maybe she doesn't want him in her life??"
July 30, 2021
–
50.0%
"oh, it's crybaby's pov again
even when she's talking abou s*x it sounds like she's about to cry
homegirl could probably talk about how sweet candy is and it would sound like she's about to burst into tears"
even when she's talking abou s*x it sounds like she's about to cry
homegirl could probably talk about how sweet candy is and it would sound like she's about to burst into tears"
July 30, 2021
–
64.0%
"she is so obsessed with him???? what did he ever do, except talk about her underwear for an uncomfortable amount of time???"
July 30, 2021
–
99.0%
"god i wonder what kind of panties Ben wears underneath his jeans, cause i couldn't see an outline, do you think he's going commando? going to keep mentioning this for the next 300 pages, don't mind me"
July 30, 2021
–
Finished Reading
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Vickie
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30 juil. 2021 22:53
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ps: if you think this book was toxic i guess you haven't read ugly love by her. imo ugly love is the most toxic stuff coho has written.
most updates and reviews i see for this are just people wishing for their own Ben and i just--- ... there's a fine line between writing problematic characters and romanticising abuse and CoHo is definitely walking on the wrong side of that in this one
good.
riiight?? and people treat this like it's the most romantic story and also seem to love ben and i just??? everything about him makes me want to throw up. i just don't get it.
would set him on fire, see how he likes it
see, that's also what i would say, but a lot of reviews for this are just like "when will i finally get my own Ben😩❤️" so apparently people are indeed into that.