logilogi-list Mailing List for LogiLogi - Software Libre for the Web (Page 6)

Georges,

I've read all your concerns and observations, all very on the same
path we are working towards, and many requests or questions that
arrise on other communities that are evaluating to use logilogi.

I believe we'll see a start on logilogi adoption on the following
release, the two weeks Wybo's talking about.

Thanks for your observations Georges,

Greetings

On Mon, Nov 24, 2008 at 7:19 PM, Wybo Wiersma <wy...@lo...> wrote:
>> Hello Wybo,
>>
>> Wybo Wiersma a écrit :
>> > Our strategy to reach this is:
>> > - First of all we will start spreading the word about LogiLogi. So far
>> >   we have not actively been doing this, because things like the UI
>> >   only working in Firefox before, and the OpenID-problems would have
>> >   scared people away. We expect to start with this within 2 weeks.
>> >   Also an article on LogiLogi will appear in a local philosophy magazine
>> >   next week.
>>
>> Would you accept to publish this article (or a similar one if there are
>> licensing issues with the magazine's editor) in Ofset's webpages, for
>> example in the wiki?
>
> That would be fine, no problem. I can add the RMLL article.
>
>> Is the article for the magazine already in a definitive version, or can
>> you still create links between this printed article and OFSET's website
>> and reciprocate? Ofset may support your work, but as it is an
>> association financed by present and future subscribers, and by
>> institutions which want evidences, it needs to communicate clearly about
>> its actions.
>
> It was already final 3 weeks ago, sorry. The magazine is probably
> already printed at this time.
>
>> > - Secondly we will add invites for peergroups to LogiLogi. So people
>> >   starting a peergroup can ask their friends to become co-founders or
>> >   to join it. This should provide at least a little more spreading.
>>
>> Is it possible for a peergroup to join Logilogi and have their own
>> "village"? For example, if the underlying mechanisms of Logilogi are
>> useful for people concerned with philosophic discussions, they can also
>> be useful for people concerned with (for example) technical discussions
>> about astronomy, or ellipsometry. Of course every peergroup can have
>> interesting interactions with neighbouring peergroups, but I suppose
>> that members of a peergroup would prefer to have a better visibilty upon
>> their preferred topic.
>
> Currently it is not possible for a peergroup to see nothing at all of
> what the others are doing. It is for example not yet possible to only
> see logis that are positively rated by one's peergroup. All that
> currently happens is that if there are multiple logis competing for
> the same tag, the one best rated by the peergroup is shown.
>
>> This question can be reworded into: is it easy for groups having various
>> interests in different topics to create their own Logis?
>
> Currently not.
>
> Still the idea is to get usefull interaction between peergroups. Also
> when things become too crowded we might add more filtering options. At
> least it's the idea to do these things only as they become needed.
>
>> > - Thirdly we will be adding e-mail notifications, so authors of Logis
>> >   will receive a notification by e-mail when their Logi has received
>> >   a comment or an annotation (possibly with weekly digest options).
>> >   This should allow a smaller number of users to form a critical mass.
>>
>> Well. I do not use any RSS-viewer, but I know people who are found of
>> them. Does currently Logilogi export RSS feeds?
>
> Not yet, but check back in a week or two and it will provide feeds of
> new logis on the front-page, recent edits, and of logis rated well by
> each peergroup, logis written by certain authors, etc...
>
> I've been adding non-openid accounts today, which will come online
> either today or tomorrow. Then the peergroup invites will be added and
> then the RSS-feeds...
>
> Wybo
>
>> Best regards,                 Georges.
>
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-- 
Bruno

After some fierce battles with bad, bad bugs, I got user friendly
accounts working today... :)

Logging in with OpenID's is still possible but no longer the
default...

Now I'll be making LL work with the new rails 2.2.

A problem with that is that gettext is no longer working under it and
they've also included a different api for rails localization which is
(badly enough) not compatible with the _("My String") notation...

For now, until someone has written a wrapper for this, we could use
a dummy method that will take all _("str")'s and translate them to
"str", so without real translation, but just so we can keep them in
the text while we wait for it (I'm quite busy).

If no one objects we can try this, and postpone translation a bit
more, while we add invites and RSS feeds... 

Wybo

---

::Student:
- Informatiekunde (computer linguistics, IR, webtech), History and Philosophy
- Member of the Center for Metahistory Groningen (http://www.rug.nl/let/cmg)

::Free Software and Open Source Developer:
- Active in the LogiLogi Foundation (http://foundation.logilogi.org)
- http://www.LogiLogi.org, Cumulative, shared commenting, publication and 
                           idea sharing: Where insight comes together...
- ComLinToo, a computational linguistics toolset written in Perl

> Hello Wybo,
> 
> Wybo Wiersma a écrit :
> > Our strategy to reach this is:
> > - First of all we will start spreading the word about LogiLogi. So far
> >   we have not actively been doing this, because things like the UI
> >   only working in Firefox before, and the OpenID-problems would have
> >   scared people away. We expect to start with this within 2 weeks.
> >   Also an article on LogiLogi will appear in a local philosophy magazine 
> >   next week.
> 
> Would you accept to publish this article (or a similar one if there are
> licensing issues with the magazine's editor) in Ofset's webpages, for
> example in the wiki?

That would be fine, no problem. I can add the RMLL article.

> Is the article for the magazine already in a definitive version, or can
> you still create links between this printed article and OFSET's website
> and reciprocate? Ofset may support your work, but as it is an
> association financed by present and future subscribers, and by
> institutions which want evidences, it needs to communicate clearly about 
> its actions.

It was already final 3 weeks ago, sorry. The magazine is probably
already printed at this time.

> > - Secondly we will add invites for peergroups to LogiLogi. So people
> >   starting a peergroup can ask their friends to become co-founders or
> >   to join it. This should provide at least a little more spreading.
> 
> Is it possible for a peergroup to join Logilogi and have their own
> "village"? For example, if the underlying mechanisms of Logilogi are
> useful for people concerned with philosophic discussions, they can also
> be useful for people concerned with (for example) technical discussions
> about astronomy, or ellipsometry. Of course every peergroup can have
> interesting interactions with neighbouring peergroups, but I suppose
> that members of a peergroup would prefer to have a better visibilty upon
> their preferred topic.

Currently it is not possible for a peergroup to see nothing at all of
what the others are doing. It is for example not yet possible to only
see logis that are positively rated by one's peergroup. All that
currently happens is that if there are multiple logis competing for
the same tag, the one best rated by the peergroup is shown.

> This question can be reworded into: is it easy for groups having various
> interests in different topics to create their own Logis? 

Currently not.

Still the idea is to get usefull interaction between peergroups. Also
when things become too crowded we might add more filtering options. At
least it's the idea to do these things only as they become needed.

> > - Thirdly we will be adding e-mail notifications, so authors of Logis
> >   will receive a notification by e-mail when their Logi has received
> >   a comment or an annotation (possibly with weekly digest options).
> >   This should allow a smaller number of users to form a critical mass.
> 
> Well. I do not use any RSS-viewer, but I know people who are found of
> them. Does currently Logilogi export RSS feeds?

Not yet, but check back in a week or two and it will provide feeds of
new logis on the front-page, recent edits, and of logis rated well by
each peergroup, logis written by certain authors, etc...

I've been adding non-openid accounts today, which will come online
either today or tomorrow. Then the peergroup invites will be added and
then the RSS-feeds...

Wybo

> Best regards,			Georges.

> > LogiLogi does not use threads, as they are problematic because they
> > fragment topics and make arguments repeat themselves, every three or
> > so months (even if they don't go off topic), rather than going
> > forward. Instead, logilogi uses tags and links that can also be added
> > by others than the original author. 
> 
> Please correct me if I make a mistake: 
> 
> as I understood Logiglogi's mean feature, this system should help a
> group of people to give birth to interesting ideas, by the mean of an
> underlying automaton which uses people's "atomic" preferences to find
> automatically which topics will be more interesting for the whole group,
> and reinforce those topics which are likely to create interesting
> debates.

Hm, no, not exactly, it currently does not do things related to
preferences.

It's a discussion-platform, and I would say it's main feature is the
ease at which it allows one to link documents together, to annotate
them with short, positioned remarks, and to filter/rank content based 
on a peergroup-selection.

These peergroups are communities that can rate eachothers work, and
that, when multiple documents exist for a tag, see eachothers work
first (when rated well).

> However, I see that the system working at http://en.logilogi.org/ is
> currently displaying a set of "tags" majoritarily pointing to homepages
> of users, and that the "tag" which is the biggest is "User", which
> redirects to the various homepages.

That's true, and a temporary problem, because the cloud is made up of 
the most frequently used tags, and as soon as there is more content on 
LogiLogi, the tags of user-pages will no longer show up there.

Still I will tweak the sizing-code a bit to make less frequent, but
still more than once occuring tags a bit bigger.

> So I would like to ask a question (outside the logi unfortunately): is
> the current state of http://en.logilogi.org/ due to a badly choosen
> season? Would the access to interesting topics be more clear at another
> time during the universitary year?

Actually, there are two explanations. First of all LogiLogi has only
been released last month with a new UI (some say our first good UI),
and only 3 days ago for IE7 (like 50% of internet users, saw a message 
that their browser was not supported until wednesday evening).

The second is that we are currently adding support for normal, local
accounts, instead of asking users to create and use an OpenID, which
many of them found either too much of a hassle, or did not understand
(I asked two people to review LogiLogi and both complained about it).

So most likely next year things will look totally different.

> And another, more general question: 
> I am a teacher of physics and chemistry, and I imagine easily an analogy
> between the fiunctions of logilogi you described and the mechanisms
> underlying a nuclear power plant: In logilogi, somebody launches an idea
> (a logi), the some people more add responses, which in turn attract more
> reactions, etc. ... ideas which lead to dead ends would die shortly,
> those which give rise to important exchanges keep alive. This is alike
> the nuclear fission : one atom of uranium explodes and emits a few
> neutrons. Each neutron can make other atoms of uranium explode. Some get
> lost, others give rise to a chain reaction. 

A nice & good comparison.

> The experience, and theoritical calculations too, show that there is a
> critical mass of uranium necessary to have at least a self-sustained
> nuclear reaction. I believe that there is some critical size with
> logilogi too: the same is true with other electronic communication
> media. For example, many mailing lists become more active when they
> count more than a threshold of about 200 subscribers. Smaller, they need
> to be feeded by some voluntary people, greater, they need to be
> moderated to avoid explosive behaviors.

I agree.

> As logilogi contains an automaton (a formula) supposed to aggregate
> subscribers' opinions in some virtuous way, I suppose that it cannot
> function if there are too few subscribers. However the automaton should
> become more effective when the number of subscribers becomes big enough.

Indeed.

> So which is your estimate of the "critical mass" of subscribers which
> may give rise to virtuous interactions? How would it be possible to feed
> logilogi beginning with a "sub-critical" mass of subscribers to reach
> this "critical mass" ?

I think it is a bit hard to guess precisely, but I expect that even a
relatively small number of people (25 to 100) can already form a critical 
mass.

Our strategy to reach this is:
- First of all we will start spreading the word about LogiLogi. So far
  we have not actively been doing this, because things like the UI
  only working in Firefox before, and the OpenID-problems would have
  scared people away. We expect to start with this within 2 weeks.
  Also an article on LogiLogi will appear in a local philosophy magazine 
  next week.
- Secondly we will add invites for peergroups to LogiLogi. So people
  starting a peergroup can ask their friends to become co-founders or
  to join it. This should provide at least a little more spreading.
- Thirdly we will be adding e-mail notifications, so authors of Logis
  will receive a notification by e-mail when their Logi has received
  a comment or an annotation (possibly with weekly digest options).
  This should allow a smaller number of users to form a critical mass.

> Have you already logged some "hyper-citical" bursts of shared ideas with
> logilogi?

Not yet so far.

Wybo

> Best regards,			Georges.

PS: I also posted this e-mail to our mailinglist, so the people there
can read it too.

---

::Student:
- Informatiekunde (computer linguistics, IR, webtech), History and Philosophy
- Member of the Center for Metahistory Groningen (http://www.rug.nl/let/cmg)

::Free Software and Open Source Developer:
- Active in the LogiLogi Foundation (http://foundation.logilogi.org)
- http://www.LogiLogi.org, Cumulative, shared commenting, publication and 
                           idea sharing: Where insight comes together...
- ComLinToo, a computational linguistics toolset written in Perl

The good news is there; LogiLogi now works in IE7 too :)

http://foundation.logilogi.org/2008/11/19/logilogi-manta-working-in-ie7

> It's very nice to hear all this news and how you keep things evolving.

:)

> On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 8:42 PM, Wybo Wiersma <wy...@lo...> wrote:
> > Hi everyone, today I and Stefano David (cconnected with the Talia app)
> > submitted a joint paper to the Digital Humanities 2009. It's on the
> > differences between LogiLogi and Talia and can be downloaded here:
> > http://en.logilogi.org/pub/DH2009/paper.pdf
> 
> I'll read it. Great you are taking fruits from your logilogi-promo
> tour last summer! and so great that is with somebody from this
> project.

Indeed, though at Talia not everything seems to be sunshine (some
internal probs)...

Anyway, I hope the paper is accepted, and regardless; LL is working in
IE now... :)

> > Also I've shown LogiLogi to someone who is really active in in the
> > Web2.0 world and he said LogiLogi had a Sexy layout now :) Good news
> > I would say, and when he tried to complement me with it, I said the
> > improvement was largely thanks to Bruno Sarlo. So well done Bruno! :)
> 
> Thanks for that Wybo... I really don't feel good about not being able
> to work at LL now... :(

Happens. I mean I'm really happy to hear from you, and such :) And we
are all busy now and then.

> > Then I was thinking of adding 2 more things, before things can take
> > off. First of all normal accounts. OpenID is nice and fluffy for us,
> > but the 2 people I've asked to give their comments on LogiLogi so far,
> > both found OpenID a hassle...
> >
> > Secondly I'm thinking of adding invites, so when someone starts a
> > peergroup, he can invite people to become co-founders/members of it,
> > so they don't have to write something first.
> 
> Both of this additions where one of the first things I was requested
> by the muniato people too. This changes will certainly motivate them
> for sure.

Good, sounds good & think so.

> > When those are done, I think of mailing to some lists and posting on
> > some forums about LogiLogi...
> 
> When do you think this will happend?

I expect some time within the next one and a half week...

(had some setbacks with IE7, popovers not working, and a cookies-
problem)

> > We now really should start thinking about things that make LogiLogi
> > better and more interesting for users...
> 
> And we will... We should also think of the SEO campaing, it will help
> spread the word. I have many ideas abou this. We should start to write
> more directly to logilogi, like adding the help sections and start

Indeed, and also let pplz on forums etc. know...

> talking about the topics of interest, just like Wybo did with the
> meaning of life and free will, both exelent.

ty :)

(have a few 100ds more ideas for Logis)

> Still, I'm willing to get back to dev... congratz for your work Wybo,

Cool :)

Pick anything you like, (like testing some things, or looking for
possible improvements in usabillity, or anything...), and let us know,

Wybo

> Greetings.
> 
> -- 
> Bruno

Wybo,

It's very nice to hear all this news and how you keep things evolving.

On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 8:42 PM, Wybo Wiersma <wy...@lo...> wrote:
> Hi everyone, today I and Stefano David (cconnected with the Talia app)
> submitted a joint paper to the Digital Humanities 2009. It's on the
> differences between LogiLogi and Talia and can be downloaded here:
> http://en.logilogi.org/pub/DH2009/paper.pdf
>

I'll read it. Great you are taking fruits from your logilogi-promo
tour last summer! and so great that is with somebody from this
project.

> Also I've shown LogiLogi to someone who is really active in in the
> Web2.0 world and he said LogiLogi had a Sexy layout now :) Good news
> I would say, and when he tried to complement me with it, I said the
> improvement was largely thanks to Bruno Sarlo. So well done Bruno! :)
>

Thanks for that Wybo... I really don't feel good about not being able
to work at LL now... :(


> Then I was thinking of adding 2 more things, before things can take
> off. First of all normal accounts. OpenID is nice and fluffy for us,
> but the 2 people I've asked to give their comments on LogiLogi so far,
> both found OpenID a hassle...
>
> Secondly I'm thinking of adding invites, so when someone starts a
> peergroup, he can invite people to become co-founders/members of it,
> so they don't have to write something first.
>

Both of this additions where one of the first things I was requested
by the muniato people too. This changes will certainly motivate them
for sure.

> When those are done, I think of mailing to some lists and posting on
> some forums about LogiLogi...
>

When do you think this will happend?

> We now really should start thinking about things that make LogiLogi
> better and more interesting for users...
>

And we will... We should also think of the SEO campaing, it will help
spread the word. I have many ideas abou this. We should start to write
more directly to logilogi, like adding the help sections and start
talking about the topics of interest, just like Wybo did with the
meaning of life and free will, both exelent.

Still, I'm willing to get back to dev... congratz for your work Wybo,

Greetings.

-- 
Bruno

Hi everyone, today I and Stefano David (cconnected with the Talia app)
submitted a joint paper to the Digital Humanities 2009. It's on the
differences between LogiLogi and Talia and can be downloaded here:
http://en.logilogi.org/pub/DH2009/paper.pdf

Also I've shown LogiLogi to someone who is really active in in the
Web2.0 world and he said LogiLogi had a Sexy layout now :) Good news
I would say, and when he tried to complement me with it, I said the
improvement was largely thanks to Bruno Sarlo. So well done Bruno! :)

I'm almost done making LL work in IE7, and I expect to have fixed the
last few remaining glitches by the end of the weekend...

Then I was thinking of adding 2 more things, before things can take
off. First of all normal accounts. OpenID is nice and fluffy for us,
but the 2 people I've asked to give their comments on LogiLogi so far,
both found OpenID a hassle...

Secondly I'm thinking of adding invites, so when someone starts a
peergroup, he can invite people to become co-founders/members of it,
so they don't have to write something first.

When those are done, I think of mailing to some lists and posting on
some forums about LogiLogi...

We now really should start thinking about things that make LogiLogi
better and more interesting for users...

greetings,

Wybo

This evening I heard the publication of the local journal in which an
article will appear on LogiLogi was a bit delayed. It will probably
appear on thursday next week.

I just fixed some bugs, mainly related to creating new Logi's when no
tags are specified. Also I made a small start at making LL work in IE
7.

Also I and Stefano David of Talia are writing a joint paper on the
differences between LogiLogi and Talia, it can be found in the docs
folder in our svn repository.

And earlier today I wrote a Logi on the compatibility of Determinism
and Free Will to have something more there that pplz can reply to...

Hope all is well,

Wybo

> > heared quite some things about the interactions inside large projects
> > like Wikipedia.
> 
> How is the inside of Wikipedia? :)

Much is beautifull, but some bits are really ugly (conflicts, edit-
wars, vandalism, etc... /)

> > Anyway, I just committed a small update, adding a list of recent
> > writings/rated logis and some stats to the user/peer_group pages.
> > (what do you think of having the activity stats instead of the
> > contenders for home-pages...?)
> 
> Great! this is the way to go. This will turn to be the profile of the
> user and we should start to add social networking features soon.

Hm. We already have some kind of social networking, with the votes and
remarks that are related to users...

I dunno if it's a good idea to add the whole thing with friend-lists
etc... We should limit our aims, but fulfill them really well...

> The peergroup with positive rated logis was also a need and is very useful.

:)

> About the recent task for adding images I think is good to move this
> way, but images is not the end of it. I would guess this need emerged
> from the meeting you had. The muniato people asked many times "why so
> little styling, how can I add an image, etc..." and I explained that
> we thought we didn't need that for debates at first, but could be
> useful to implement. I think we should start to move forward this way,
> but images are not the end of it. I think we should have the
> possibility to attach documents and graphics to the logis (or attach
> them to set of tags), and I also think we should be able to interact
> with attachments. For example, we should be able to mark regions of a
> picture, mark and comment text of a PDF and so on. We could have some
> kind of import process where we keep the attachment but we also have a
> simplified version for interaction. This also brings other ideas and
> needs, and are some rough idea, but we should think about them I
> believe.

I think that in the future this might be nice, but given the amount of
work it would be (and our limited resources), I think we'd better 
postpone it a bit...

Today I implemented support for external links, these are links
outside of LogiLogi, but they are added like remarks, and thus there
can be multiple for the same word, etc... Also this removes the need
for having the link-buttons in the tinymce editor.

Next on schedule are, I think allowing the removal of links, remarks,
etc, so logi-owners and pplz inserting stuff can correct their own
mistakes easily, and when that's done we need to make it work in IE7
and then spread the word...

Wybo

> Great work Wybo, LL is looking amazing, really nice.
> 
> -- 
> Bruno

On Sun, Nov 2, 2008 at 9:11 PM, Wybo Wiersma <wy...@lo...> wrote:
> The conference yesterday was interesting. Met some nice people, and
> heared quite some things about the interactions inside large projects
> like Wikipedia.
>

How is the inside of Wikipedia? :)

> Anyway, I just committed a small update, adding a list of recent
> writings/rated logis and some stats to the user/peer_group pages.
> (what do you think of having the activity stats instead of the
> contenders for home-pages...?)
>

Great! this is the way to go. This will turn to be the profile of the
user and we should start to add social networking features soon.

The peergroup with positive rated logis was also a need and is very useful.

About the recent task for adding images I think is good to move this
way, but images is not the end of it. I would guess this need emerged
from the meeting you had. The muniato people asked many times "why so
little styling, how can I add an image, etc..." and I explained that
we thought we didn't need that for debates at first, but could be
useful to implement. I think we should start to move forward this way,
but images are not the end of it. I think we should have the
possibility to attach documents and graphics to the logis (or attach
them to set of tags), and I also think we should be able to interact
with attachments. For example, we should be able to mark regions of a
picture, mark and comment text of a PDF and so on. We could have some
kind of import process where we keep the attachment but we also have a
simplified version for interaction. This also brings other ideas and
needs, and are some rough idea, but we should think about them I
believe.

Great work Wybo, LL is looking amazing, really nice.

-- 
Bruno

The conference yesterday was interesting. Met some nice people, and
heared quite some things about the interactions inside large projects
like Wikipedia.

Anyway, I just committed a small update, adding a list of recent
writings/rated logis and some stats to the user/peer_group pages.
(what do you think of having the activity stats instead of the
contenders for home-pages...?)

Besides that I did some small back-end cleanups, adding the use of
named scopes.

Wybo

> Wybo and all,
> 
> It's very nice to see the new UI alive and kicking!

Bruno and Miguel, indeed it's great to see the new UI blooming :)

And also big thanks for you two on this, because even if I did much
of the integration work in the last few weeks, without you two it
would never have been as good!

About busyness, I see and understand. I'm self busy too now and then,
so it happens. As long as we do something now and then, do what we 
like now and then, the project will thrive...

Tomorrow I will be having an english test near Amsterdam - as for my
studying in or around London next year I will need to pass an English
TOEFL test, and with higher grades than native English speakers score
on average...  will be a challenge :)

And after a night's stay at the place of a friend of mine in Amsterdam
I will on saturday go to a 1-day conference on Wiki's, organized by 
Wikimedia to see what they are up to :)... no just for inspiration and
interest...

Today I did some small fixes on LL, and it was a great experience...
Where with the previous UI everything felth chunky and about to break,
it now went like a snap, changing tags and updating texts :) Hope more
pplz will start to agree :)

Will get into content & probably more more small updates next week...
and then mail people and groups about the release... 

But also have to do more stuff for my studies as of then & coming
months...

Wybo

Wybo and all,

It's very nice to see the new UI alive and kicking!

This has been a group work and we did many parts as a team, but
clearly Wybo's efforts and commitment is what makes LL what it is
today...

congratz!

greetings

On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 9:50 AM, Wybo Wiersma <wy...@lo...> wrote:
> LogiLogi Manta is live with the new UI!
>
> http://foundation.logilogi.org/2008/10/30/logilogi-manta-live-with-real-ui
>
> Nicely in time before an article is published about it in a local
> philosophy magazine (the Qualia, of the philosophy faculty of the
> University of Groningen).
>
> Let's hope Manta is getting alive now,
>
> Wybo
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
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-- 
Bruno

Great news Wybo!

Last month was a very busy month for me, I hope I will be more active on LL
in November.

Congrats,

Miguel


On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 12:50 PM, Wybo Wiersma <wy...@lo...> wrote:

> LogiLogi Manta is live with the new UI!
>
> http://foundation.logilogi.org/2008/10/30/logilogi-manta-live-with-real-ui
>
> Nicely in time before an article is published about it in a local
> philosophy magazine (the Qualia, of the philosophy faculty of the
> University of Groningen).
>
> Let's hope Manta is getting alive now,
>
> Wybo
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's
> challenge
> Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK & win great
> prizes
> Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world
> http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
> _______________________________________________
> LogiLogi-list mailing list
> Log...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/logilogi-list
>

LogiLogi Manta is live with the new UI!

http://foundation.logilogi.org/2008/10/30/logilogi-manta-live-with-real-ui

Nicely in time before an article is published about it in a local 
philosophy magazine (the Qualia, of the philosophy faculty of the
University of Groningen).

Let's hope Manta is getting alive now,

Wybo

> > This morning I had my first calebazo of Yerba Mate :) The powerfull
> > Urugayan tea :) I really like the taste of it, and will most likely
> > be using it quite regularily... :) Ty Bruno (& Miguel) for bringing
> > met into contact with it :) Much better than coffee, which I did not
> > really like...
> 
> you see, I think it's very nice that you got interested in Mate...
> it's part of the cultural exchange we do :)

I like it very much too, to be tasting Uruguayan culture :)

Also I have been drinking Mate during the weekend, and I had it again
this evening, and I really do like it :)

/me is becoming Uruguayan, now only I still need to learn Spanish :)

> I started writing down a howto prepare the mate, but had some problems
> with pictures, but I'll try to finish it today, and hope to transmit
> to you as much as possible about our culture of preparing mate :)

Cool :) Looking forward to it...

I am already developing some 'habits'. What I did today was add 
cold water first and then pour boiling water on top, so I don't have 
to turn the water-cooker off at 70 degrees, before it cooks...

Also I got a special plastic box already for my mate, so I don't have
to handle the big 1kg bag each time... :)

---

On LogiLogi; I just committed quite some fixes, mostly of small things
that were still broken. Tomorrow I will do some more fixes and start
preparing things for the installation on the server. Then, if all goes
well we will be able to launch a fully working Manta with the new UI on 
wednesday... :)

> > We will launch next week, even if it means that some things don't
> > fully work yet, or are not done entirely neatly. Just so we can start
> > using it, and the people reading about it in the local Qualia magazine
> > have something to look at... :)
> >
> > Some bughunting and fixing would be really helpfull :)
> 
> I'm very sorry that I've abandoned dewing this last period, luckily
> you keep up the work and move things forward... great job Wybo

Hm... yup. Though it feels a bit sad now and then (nevertheless still
devving fun and good to see progress). Anyway, I hope there will be 
some more interest / devving after launch... as my time will be more
limited the coming months...

> > For the weekend I will be at a local LAN; my first LAN since years :)
> 
> jaja! mate is a very social drink here and either when studying or LAN
> party it's a good companion :)

:) It was good indeed. I really owned at RTS-games, lost no matches of 
AOE II and TA Spring, while being average at shooters and racing, which 
is better than before :) It was fun and relaxing in other words, and
the mate was at my side till dawn :)

Wybo

> Have a good weekend!
> 
> -- 
> Bruno

On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 11:40 AM, Wybo Wiersma <wy...@lo...> wrote:
> This morning I had my first calebazo of Yerba Mate :) The powerfull
> Urugayan tea :) I really like the taste of it, and will most likely
> be using it quite regularily... :) Ty Bruno (& Miguel) for bringing
> met into contact with it :) Much better than coffee, which I did not
> really like...
>

you see, I think it's very nice that you got interested in Mate...
it's part of the cultural exchange we do :)

I started writing down a howto prepare the mate, but had some problems
with pictures, but I'll try to finish it today, and hope to transmit
to you as much as possible about our culture of preparing mate :)

>
> We will launch next week, even if it means that some things don't
> fully work yet, or are not done entirely neatly. Just so we can start
> using it, and the people reading about it in the local Qualia magazine
> have something to look at... :)
>
> Some bughunting and fixing would be really helpfull :)

I'm very sorry that I've abandoned dewing this last period, luckily
you keep up the work and move things forward... great job Wybo

>
> For the weekend I will be at a local LAN; my first LAN since years :)
>

jaja! mate is a very social drink here and either when studying or LAN
party it's a good companion :)

Have a good weekend!

-- 
Bruno

This morning I had my first calebazo of Yerba Mate :) The powerfull
Urugayan tea :) I really like the taste of it, and will most likely
be using it quite regularily... :) Ty Bruno (& Miguel) for bringing
met into contact with it :) Much better than coffee, which I did not
really like...

I just committed more improvements to the UI. The insert wizzard
should be working now, albeit still with some small bugs here and
there...

I also added some things to the logi-view page, and fixed some bugs
there... (like remarks submit).

I also added a new, and edit-wizzard, but did not test their workings
yet...

We will launch next week, even if it means that some things don't
fully work yet, or are not done entirely neatly. Just so we can start 
using it, and the people reading about it in the local Qualia magazine
have something to look at... :)

I will be devving again as of monday, and will be pushing some other
things off my todo-list in order to make manta at least presentable...

Some bughunting and fixing would be really helpfull :)

For the weekend I will be at a local LAN; my first LAN since years :)

greetings,

Wybo

> Exelent work wybo, it works like a charm, it is really very neat and
> let's you dive into the tags cloud...
> 
> :)

Exelent work wybo, it works like a charm, it is really very neat and
let's you dive into the tags cloud...

:)

On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 12:00 PM, Wybo Wiersma <wy...@lo...> wrote:
> I just committed the browsing tool, all hooked up, and working via
> AJAX. Should be fully usable now in FF, and I will test and tweak it
> in IE tomorrow evening as needed...
>
> Will start hooking up the wizzards, etc. now and this evening,
>
> Next week will be for small fixes and tweaks, and then we can launch
> the english version on the main site at the end of next week :)
>
> Wybo
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge
> Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK & win great prizes
> Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world
> http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
> _______________________________________________
> LogiLogi-list mailing list
> Log...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/logilogi-list
>



-- 
Bruno

I just committed the browsing tool, all hooked up, and working via
AJAX. Should be fully usable now in FF, and I will test and tweak it
in IE tomorrow evening as needed...

Will start hooking up the wizzards, etc. now and this evening,

Next week will be for small fixes and tweaks, and then we can launch
the english version on the main site at the end of next week :)

Wybo

Just committed an improved version of the browse-tool, with the icons
and all working (via llcorners + resizing).

Will test it in IE and hook it up via ajax next week,

greetings,

Wybo

> What still needs doing is the peergroup select dropdown, the
> border around the logi in IE7, the info with the wizzards and
> hooking up the browse tool via AJAX.
> 
> I will be doing the latter 2 tasks tomorrow, or at least make a 
> good start with them,
> 
> Wybo

Most likely our paper on LogiLogi will be published in a local
philosophy magazine around the end of october, which should get 
us a first wave of users... :)

With a bit effort we can launch by then, and I will be devving
full time tomorrow (tuesdays and thursdays and an occasional 
evening & weekend day I have free for devving for the coming 
weeks),

What still needs doing is the peergroup select dropdown, the
border around the logi in IE7, the info with the wizzards and
hooking up the browse tool via AJAX.

I will be doing the latter 2 tasks tomorrow, or at least make a 
good start with them,

Wybo

I just committed an improved version of the tags browser JS... It's
not hooked up yet, but you can see the tool working on the browser
tab... Add and enter adds the tag, backspace removes it.

Will improve it further and hook it up with the cloud on thursday. We
are getting closer to being able to launch... :)

Wybo

I just committed a cleanup of llCorners, and I added some images from
the design, like the clouds for the steps in the insert-wizzard...

These images are added and resized automatically from svg via
llCorners, see the README_FOR_APP for the additional rsvg 
requirements...

This cleanup of llcorners was a little something I did during some
less active parts of the family-weekend...

When I can make the time I might do some work on the wizzards
tomorrow,

greetings,

Wybo

Apparently I got ill because of swimming in icy cold water, as I feel quite bad today (feverish, etc...).

Hope to be better tomorrow, as at the end of the day there is a local Ruby User Group meeting in Groningen on which I'd show LogiLogi to some people...

Wybo